OP/Ed by Shelley Lubben
Cindi,
You have permission to print the below-
Well, as usual, no performers showed up to the Standards Board meeting even though it was right there in Van Nuys in the middle of the porn capitol where quite a few porn stars and porn producers live within fifteen minutes.
Hmmm…
AVN reporter Mark Kernes showed up in order to probably write ANOTHER article on “Shelley Lubben’s lies” and I’m sure he’ll mention Veronica Lain, former porn star who also gave public comment that he will try to discredit. So, watch for that. He loves to write about me. I’m Mark Kerne’s favorite subject J
Kevin Bland, lawyer on behalf of Free Speech Coalition, said he represented producers and performers. I think it’s the first time I ever heard him say he represents performers.
Um, Free Speech Coalition does not represent performers. Diane Duke has stated many times at public hearings that FSC mainly represents producers.
Also, Kevin was pretty much forced to say that because he was the only one from FSC who showed up to the meeting who gave public comment. Apparently, Free Speech Coalition cares more about .xxx domains than safety and health of workers. Instead, Free Speech Coalition showed up in full force at San Francisco’s Union Square today knowing FULL WELL that the Standards Board meeting was about safety and health for workers and yet they felt it was MORE IMPORTANT to show up and “fight” against the .xxx domains than FIGHT for your safety and health!
Read it for yourself: http://freespeechcoalition.com/
I made a statement to the Standards Board that “why is it for the last year hardly any performers have showed up to Calosha meetings? And why aren’t they here today especially when this meeting is held right in the middle of porn valley?”
Because they are afraid of repercussions from their porn bosses, that’s why.
What I can’t figure out is why FSC doesn’t pay performers off to show up to these meetings. They have offered money to the girls we have helped to turn on Pink Cross. Surely they can hire some trained porn stars to come to the meeting and tell everyone how great the adult film industry is.
Anyway, the meeting went great and was in workers’ favor and the ball keeps rolling.
Enforced safety and health protection for workers is on its way courtesy of Pink Cross, AHF, LA County Public Department of Health, Calosha, UCLA, Los Angeles Times, American Medical Association and many more.
Note to employers (producers):
Be sure to stock up on condoms because you’re going to need them.
Note to employees (performers):
Don’t Sign what you don’t Understand!!!!
If you need help understanding your contracts or are just downright sick of porn and need legal help, please contact Pink Cross and we will try to find a lawyer to help you. We don’t want you to be “screwed” by the porn industry anymore!
See you on June 7, the next meeting regarding YOUR SAFETY AND HEALTH!
Shelley
Shelley Lubben
Executive Director, Pink Cross Foundation
www.shelleylubben.com
NL- Mark? FSC? Anyone that would like to write a response, happy to have you do so.
FSC says- FSC/industry was repped at OSHA meeting today despite being in SF 4 ICANN. We’ll definitely be at the meeting in June
I wasn’t aware of this meeting. What was said?
Why is it that no current performers came out and supported Mrs. Lubben’s side of the story? Isn’t it odd that not one member of the constituency that Lubben proclaims she represents comes out in support of her nonsense? Only disgruntled wash-outs attend events with her, lured with promises of living off the Pink Cross teet.
The truth is this was not a significant hearing on the Cal/OSHA matter. It was a business meeting. The important meeting is in June, and we’ll see who turns up then.
I love the fact that St. Shelley closes with yet another insult to adult performers: “Don’t Sign what you don’t Understand!!!!” As she told a stupefied audience in Cambridge during her colossal flop last month, adult performers are all just stupid girls who can’t even read the contracts they’re handed. How utterly condescending. Thank G-d they have St. Shelley to explain the world to them. Pathetic.
It’s also quite telling that she places Pink Cross at the top of the list of organizations who are driving this condom charade/crusade. Pink Cross didn’t file the OSHA complaints or any of the litigation – no, Lubben had better use for that money (if what she said at Cambridge is true, last year she gave herself a raise). Lubben is simply along for the publicity ride.
Today the adult industry indeed held a protest outside the ICANN meeting in San Francisco, in opposition to the new .XXX sTLD. Unfortunately for Shelley Lubben, among the performers (past and present) who DID show up at that assembly was Brooke Ashley. Yes, the same Brooke Ashley who ran screaming from the Pink Cross Cult, err, I mean Foundation. Sorry about that error; my backspace key keeps sticking. Anyway, Brooke aka Ann Marie is a wonderful, amazing and generous young woman. I’m proud to know her.
Coverage of the .XXX protest can currently be seen on the cbs2 website.
I’m here on the ground in SF (to shoot the protest as well as some interviews for forthcoming episodes of “The Devil And Shelley Lubben”) — I’m actually sitting at the ICANN meeting now, and I saw this “news” item tweeted by Cindi. No offense intended to Cindi with my quotation marks; she’s just relaying the garbage from St. Shelley.
See you in June, Shelley. I am truly looking forward to it. The adult industry does LOVE it when you testify, Shelley. You’re so ridiculously over-the-top, you make the pro-porn side of the argument that much more compelling.
Oh, and look for more episodes of the documentary real soon. I’ve been speaking with lots of people from your past (porn and non-porn alike). Funny how NOT ONE person remembers events the way you describe them. Isn’t that odd?
And Shelley, what is it you were doing alone in that bathroom stall for 40 minutes prior to the Cambridge debate, while everyone else was eating dinner? Did it have anything to do with why you were later swaying back and forth and slurring your words as you so often do? Just curious.
Oh, and if Shelley wants to actually prove rather than libelously assert that FSC has offered to pay performers to turn on Pink Cross, then we can talk about it. (You should be careful about things like that too, Cindi, Op/Ed or not.) Put up or shut up, Lubben, you charlatan. Show us an email, play us a tape recording, post a video proving what you say. Show us proof that FSC has actually offered to pay performers to turn against you. Not a statement from one of the sheeple sucking on the Pink Cross teet — proof. An actual communication from FSC to a performer offering money to betray you.
Paying people to turn against her! LOL Lubben’s arrogance is matched only by her persecution complex. It also goes a long way to show that Lubben thinks the ONLY important motivating factor in the world is money. Not principal, not ethics — money. Spoken like the cheap whore that she’s always been.
Not a word of concern about safety and health for any of the workers Michael?
I never see you show up at these meetings either caring about workers’ health.
We’ll see on June 7 how much you care about workers. I’m sure the performers would love to know you will attend that meeting in vigorous favor of offering them a safer workplace.
Or maybe you’ll just show up in your true colors to stalk your favorite obsession.
We’ll see.
We’ll just go shoot outside the city limits of LA or shoot outside the state!! They’ll never find us!! maybe we’ll go shoot up there in Buggersfield on Union ave or at the bakersfield rescue mission and give those IN the closet directors there a show of hardcore at its best!! yeah!! Maybe shoot a scene right there in shelly’s neighborhood with all the trucks and cars parked out front!! what do u think Jeremy? U want to direct??
Not a word in response to any of my statements or challenges, Shelley?
I am Jack’s total lack of surprise.
The greater threat to adult performers, St. Shelley, is cheap charlatans like you. But not for long.
I’ll be there in June, babe, don’t you worry, and I’ll let actual current performers speak for themselves. Not low-end wash-outs like you have in your stable. I’ll be there to support performers right to choose, as well as their right to control their own bodies and make a living.
And, of course, I’ll continue to feed your opponents all the research I’ve compiled on you. Just like I did in Cambridge.
How did that feel, Roxy?
More’s headed your way. Think you’re ready?
Michael Whiteacre,
If I recall correctly, back when Shelley Lubben was shooting porn, many of the companies would film a “disclaimer” with the talent after their scenes. They would directly ask the performers questions such as “Are you under the influence of drugs or alcohol?” or “Did you do the shoot of your own free will?” or “Were you coerced in any way during the shooting of this scene?”
Perhaps you could contact some of the companies Shelley Lubben worked for and ask to take a look at Shelly’s “disclaimers.” It should prove interesting! What do you think?
I’m sick of this bullshit going back and forth–“you’re going down, you abusive pimp” “no, you’re going down, you cheap whore”.
Its so sad that NOBODY CARES! And this meeting has proved that Cal-Osha doesn’t care about porn performers’ health. They keep on delaying any sort of action on this issue and they would perpetually do so. The Colonel, as he usually is, was right about this issue.
Seriously, the STD level needs to go down. There needs to be better STD practices and a proper union for performers. But if performers themselves don’t care, what’s the point?
Shit spiegs, you’ve been in it for awhile, if anyone would know someone from “LBO Entertainment” that’s still alive and stateside, it would be you. Get on it!! Somebody give Rodney Moore a call while we’re at it. Although from what Lizzy Borden’s said about ole’ King O’ Cream, there might be a liitle wieght to Shelley’s stories after all. Too bad LIB has a working relationship with The Lubester’, I’d love to see a pic of Jack Nicholson as the joker right next to Shelley’s pic up there. The resemblance is uncanny.
Who did Shelley say was paid to turn on her? She mentions some sort of a conspiracy to discredit her but offers no real evidence that such a thing happened.
Some of the comments here are the typical and pathetic ones that come from scum bag pornographers. Don’t bullshit a bullshitter. Most porn scum bags would think nothing of putting their own mothers or daughters in a gang bang or Bukakkee for a buck. Sane, intelligent and moral people who worked in this shit hole industry for many years know the real score. The porn biz lies out there asses to the world and always tries to whitewash the real truths. Yea there are couple of decent people here and there, but by and large porn valley is made up and run by abusive scum bags, criminals, sociopaths, drug addicts, alcoholics and many other dregs of humanity. Shelley Lubben is more right than she is wrong… that’s a fact. I know that burns the asses of scum bag porn producers real bad… it makes them lose money… decent people just don’t aspire to work in the porn industry. It attracts broken people not capable or willing to contribute to society is a meaningful way. It’s on par with being a pimp or a drug dealer… no matter how much you try to bullshit the general public otherwise.
I smell a sock…
I don’t quite know how to put it into words but one thing I know for sure…
WAY TOO MANY people that make porn hate women or think of them as a lesser species. A beautiful woman thats doing porn should not be used and abused the way many girls are. From websites like Donkey Punch, Max Hardcore, Throat Gagers, and other sites like that to even regular mainstream sites like Bangbros, Brazzars, Blacks on Blonds, and NA you see girls getting treated poorly.
A few years back I saw my favorite porn star on a bangbros episode and the voiceover guy that tells people what to do told a particularly huge cocked guy to tear her pussy up. He was pounding her really hard and she definately looked like she was not into it. Guys will fuck the girl doggie style and push the girls face into the floor and put their foot on the girls heads like they putting out a lit cigarette on the floor, shove their cock down the girls throat til her face turns red and she gags, really hard anal sex and DPs, etc… I could go on all day with examples of mistreated girls.
When this subject comes up on various porn forums the vast majority of porn fans say they don’t like seeing the girls mistreated. I’ve seen interviews with girls who have left the business and said that it was not like when they started in the business and over the years it has gotten too rough. So why do they make so much of porn material thats abusive when very few people like it? I can only think the guys making porn want to see that or they think this is what the fans want to see.
Honestly, it cuts both ways. While the amount of rough sex has gone up in the past decade, there are ALOT more female performers than there were in the 70s-90s. As a result, women have more of a voice in the Industry. There are more female directors than there once were. There is also more of a focus on authentic female sexual pleasure than the porn of the Golden Age. Look at the releases from Elegant Angel. Look at Manuel Ferrara. Even the rough sex titles done by Kink and Evil Angel feature real female orgasms.
Hell, more women are watching porn now than ever before.
The types like Khan Tusion and Max Hardcore aren’t really that popular anymore and they’re not coming back.
Origen your post kinda confuses me. Are you saying that the rough mistreatment of the female talent that seems to be ramping up over the last 10 years or so is because there are more female directors?
Adding a few more female porn directors does not explain why the female talent is being treated so bad? In the 70s and 80s if some guy shoved his cock down Seka or Sharon Mitchells throat til she puked and her face turned red as an apple (and she could not breathe) I bet they would have said “FUCK YOU GUYS” and walked off the set.
If you view rough scenes and degrading porn as a type of fetish, then, I believe, the issue is easier to see in the context of the market for adult content as a whole.
Because of the internet, and the boom in xxx production since the 1990s, and the ease with which people can now shoot, edit and publish their own content –as well as the ease with which people can seek out very specific types of porn or erotica, the market for porn has become very fragmented, or segmented. If you want to find puking porn, it’s out there. The same goes for foot porn, fatty porn, enema movies, etc…
As the comment above notes, these titles sell because there’s a market for them. Misogynists exist in this world. Some make misogynist porn, some buy misogynist porn. But, as distasteful as one may find any particular type of adult content, such content IS protected. The whole point of the First Amendment is to protect UNpopular speech — because popular speech doesn’t need protection; it’s popular.
I will also take issue with one of your points, Karmafan — you seem to imply that the entirety of this rough or dominating sex constitutes mistreating female performers. You neglect to consider two points: 1) there exist performers (and civilians) who enjoy rough sex and/or being dominated; and 2) it’s not only female performers who are on the receiving end of domination or sexual aggression on video — look at Kink’s movies, or fem-dom movies in general.
I’m not talking about a small niche segment like fem-dom or kink.com and such. That small part of the porn industry is like that because its what the fetish is all about and I’m sure any porn star that does that type of work knows what she is in for.
Generally speaking you don’t find the porn industry as a whole has been slowly moving in a direction where the girls are being treated more and more rougher and degraded as opposed to 15-25 years ago?
@Karmafan – I don’t think the industry has moved in that direction, but that there’s just a lot more diverse kinds of product that has been put to market since the days of the Caballero VHS box. Back then Gonzo had yet to become a market force. With its success, and the growth of other genres and subgenres, the more aggressive and fetishistic movies found, or resonated with, an audience. In my view, Max Hardcore’s movies were simply hardcore fetish movies, with performances nearly as broad and arch as in a bondage movie.
Sometimes, simple loigistics are ignored. Who the hell just lays down for honest-to-God mistreatment? If I got a job at Mcdonalds and my manager started throwing fry grease and thousand island dressing at me, I would walk the fuck out and report his ass.
The last time I can remember a performer quitting the biz immediately after being “mis-treated” was the Reagan Star/Khan Tusion incident. And anyone whos seen that scene and is familiar with Reagan’s other performances, can tell you even that was complete bullshit. I’m not trying to say it doesn’t happen, I’m just saying it seems like a highly unlikely scenario that people in the porn biz stand in for real abuse without going to the authorities. Let’s see some real examples backed up by fact, not opinion, that would constitute this.
Back to the original topic. Has anyone read Gene Ross’ recent piece on Lubben? I wish I could have, but the site it was on had these huge pictures covering up large chunks of the words.
NL-My feeling is that Gene is selling his site to Adult Cyber Mart which is why he’s pimping them so heavily. Many intros to his stories are sending people to ACM, and some stories are not even stories, just an excuse to get people to go there. Whatever it is I wish Gene the best, the man has certainly served his time…
“If I got a job at Mcdonalds and my manager started throwing fry grease and thousand island dressing at me, I would walk the fuck out and report his ass. ”
Still laughing….LOL
And, lest we forget, under the law workers can lodge anonymous complaints about workplace issues. This whole claim that adult performers and other industry workers are being threatened and intimidated into not complaining out of fear of getting blacklisted, or other reprisals, is simply bullshit.
Michael Whiteacre,
Did you read what I posted above?
“If I recall correctly, back when Shelley Lubben was shooting porn, many of the companies would film a “disclaimer” with the talent after their scenes. They would directly ask the performers questions such as “Are you under the influence of drugs or alcohol?” or “Did you do the shoot of your own free will?” or “Were you coerced in any way during the shooting of this scene?”
Perhaps you could contact some of the companies Shelley Lubben worked for and ask to take a look at Shelly’s “disclaimers.” It should prove interesting! What do you think?”
Thank you, Mark. I’ve already been in contact with some of those producers and records-keepers. I’ve amassed a huge stack of paperwork. Her arguments are a joke.
It makes you wonder how different Shelley would be if she had worked with a more respected company like Vivid, instead of L.B.O. and Rodney.
I have a question for Michael. First of all, I am a former Shelley fan and I have watched your episodes and was shocked at what I saw (like her opinions on Asians etc) but why do you say that the people who attend events with her are disgruntled wash-outs and low-ends? This is not respectful. We are talking about people like Chrissy Moran, Jan Meza and April Garris for example. Oh and of course your new friend Ann Marie who is now “wonderful, amazing” because she turned away from Pink Cross? In another thread you said you wanted the opinions of Maddy (Michelle Avanti) and Jan Meza, do you really think they will want to be interviewed by you after hearing your low opinion of them? I understand you are very critical of Shelley, and I have too become very disappointed with her, but you don`t know the whole story of these women who are coming to her and they don`t deserve to be called what you are calling them.
Sorry honey but the adult industry is not “respectful”. Neither is the real world for that matter…
Dear Fiol,
I am truly sorry to read you have become disappointed in me. But I am more disappointed you have listened to a man who produces pornography and who has nothing better to do than take all of my videos and edit them out of context in order to deceive people about me.
Also, do you have ANY idea how difficult this whole outreach has been for me and my family? In the beginning it was ONLY me standing up to a billion dollar industry but I put my neck out there anyways to offer these people in porn a better life.
Where is the compassion for someone like me who has fought and showed up to court consistently to protect these women, to fight against sex trafficking, to pull them out of porn and to find help for them and to support them emotionally, mentally and physically.
I think you have listened to the porn industry and believed them. I am sorry to disappoint you but they are liars and you may want to look up their backgrounds and their movies and the violence they subject women to. You are listening to modern day slave traders over a woman who has sacrificed her life to save and help others from the porn slave trade.
That is truly disappointing. I hope you will change your mind and please continue to support me and Pink Cross in this terrible fight against evil.
Thank you and God bless.
Let’s not make things personal now. Please–this goes to everyone arguing the issue of OSHA guidelines on this blog. It takes vigilance to get ANYTHING done in life. People are going to criticize you and the only key to success to to rise above the criticism with faith in God and superiority in argument.
I’m sorry Shelly, I applaud your organization for many things but some things you have said are wrong. And I am not evil for believing that.
Thanks Origen, appreciate the constructive criticism and need it.
May God direct all of our paths as we acknowledge Him.
Shelly, I applaud you for being the one of the first to show TRUTHFULLY the emotional pain and exposure to disease that many female performers go through in the adult industry. These are arguments that are very persuasive and ones that the adult industry (even female performers themselves) do not like to talk about. How you told us that Jersey Jaxin layed in a warm bath with epsom salt and then cried with a roommate after an intense scene. That is true for many performers and presents a very compelling argument against porn or for why things need to change.
I know you don’t need advice but I would to suggest for you to go back to telling to truth. The adult industry is many things but they definitely are not slave traders. Lets call things as they are–factual honesty breeds emotional honesty.
Dear Fiol,
Thank you for your comment. I’m glad to have the opportunity to address the concerns you raised. You write that I am not respectful of these Pink Cross women — my response is that these women, who allow their voices and personal stories to be used in a campaign to vilify and demonize EVERY OTHER ADULT INDUSTRY WORKER WHO DOES NOT AGREE WITH THEIR SLURRING PROPHET are the ones who are being truly disrespectful.
Simply stated — if one were really trying to “help” adult industry performers, one would not further demonize, insult and stereotype them — IT IS THAT VERY PUBLIC PERCEPTION of “porn stars” as a group (i.e., they are all morally bankrupt, disease-ridden, mentally ill drug addicts and alcoholics) that makes it difficult for performers to transition back into the “civilian” world should they decide to leave the industry. But, of course, phony saviors need to knock down their prey with passive aggressive manipulation — like Lubben attempts with you, directly above: “you have listened to the porn industry and believed them. I am sorry to disappoint you but they are liars and you may want to look up their backgrounds and their movies and the violence they subject women to. You are listening to modern day slave traders over a woman who has sacrificed her life to save and help others from the porn slave trade.” She then follows with the classic, I’m not angry, I’m just very disappointed… This is the kind of stuff CULTS do.
You write, “In another thread you said you wanted the opinions of Maddy (Michelle Avanti) and Jan Meza, do you really think they will want to be interviewed by you after hearing your low opinion of them?” Why not? Shelley Lubben knows all too well my opinion of her and SHE had the intestinal fortitude to debate me. Do Lubben’s followers not have the courage of their convictions? Are they really nothing more than “sheeple?” If I’m wrong, I’m prepared to stand corrected. Was I supposed to lure them in early on, to get them on the record through false pretenses — by claiming to be impartial? I am their critic. If they are unprepared or unwilling to face their critics then they have no place on the public stage.
As for my characterization of these women, I think I’m being generous. Have you ever actually heard Jenni Case’s story, for example? She was in “the sex industry” most of her adult life — but only made 13 movies over 2 years or so (by my calculation). And what’s her complaint with the porn business? She caught chlamydia and UTI’s which — OF COURSE! — MUST HAVE derived from her sideline in porn and not from her years and years of flatbacking. Of course. Have you SEEN these women? THESE WERE LOW-END PERFORMERS, make no mistake. They were not going to be Vivid boxcover girls, let’s just say that. Stardom would elude them just as it did poor, tweaked-out Shelley “Roxy” Moore. That aspect, and the motivation it may provide to all these women, cannot be overlooked.
You are correct when you write that I do not know the whole story of these women — but I offer two responses: 1) none of us know their whole stories because Lubben (again, with cult-like methodology) refuses to allow them to include ANY positive experiences in their (re-written) “testimony.” We only hear and read what Lubben allows us to hear and read. 2) Whatever else these women may have done in their pasts, has NO bearing on what they are doing now. They are hurting people, demonizing a legal industry, insulting and degrading an entire class of people — and were they to succeed they’s be driving many of these performers into far more dangerous circumstances (many porn shoots would be driven underground, and many of these performers would likely be forced to turn to less safe kinds of work to make ends meet).
As for Ann Marie, fka Brooke Ashley, she IS amazing. She’s dealt with more tragedy and pain than most of us can imagine. She’s hurting every day. But she is a woman of conscience. Unlike these other Lubben acolytes, she put her foot down and refused to stand by while her friends — PEOPLE WHO HAD HELPED HER AND OFFERED SUPPORT — were attacked and vilified by Lubben. She was lured in to Pink Cross in a moment of weakness. She was exploited and victimized by Lubben. Lubben did NOTHING for her. Ann even paid for her own trip to Vegas in January, while Pink Cross donations paid for the Lubben family’s stay at The Venetian.
Finally, my larger point about adult performers vis-a-vis Pink Cross is stated above: “Why is it that no current performers came out and supported Mrs. Lubben’s side of the story? Isn’t it odd that not one member of the constituency that Lubben proclaims she represents comes out in support of her nonsense?”
Now, on to you, Lubben:
Regarding your tepid response, I find it hilarious that, aside from refusing to address ANY of the questions and comments I offered above, the only defense you can muster for your lies and outrageous statements is that I am editing them “out of context.” We’ve been down this road before; I released the entire video of our joint interview outside the Rainbow Bar and Grill — uncut — so that nothing could be taken out of context. Furthermore, the videos and audio interviews from which her other portions of the documentary derive are readily available on the internet. It’s odd that yo have so little faith in the intelligence of the audience.
Next, as you well know, I DO NOT SHOOT HARDCORE PORNOGRAPHY. It’s not as easy as simply lumping me in with the porn industry. I support them on ethical and philosophical grounds — and because I despise what you’re doing. I’ve never taken A SINGLE CENT from the porn lobby. EVER. I pay my own way, and any efforts I’ve ever made on its behalf have been done pro bono.
Additionally your characterization of yourself as “a woman who has sacrificed her life to save and help others from the porn slave trade” is pure and utter bullshit. YOU HAD NO LIFE. You’ve never been an independent woman. You went from living at home, to having a pimp (and later, according to you, victimizing other women by being a madam), and then, after years of drug and alcohol-induced free-fall, during which time you put your eldest child through the most disgusting, harmful, despicable, and irresponsible shit I’ve ever heard of from a parent, you got married to someone whose army benefits covered your ass. THIS IS THE LIFE OF WHICH YOU HAD DREAMED SINCE CHILDHOOD — a life on the stage. You flunked out as a porn star, but NOW you get to be a famous EX-Porn star. You go to all the conventions, hang out with them, get your picture taken with them, dress like them, make yourself up like them (G-d help us — you look like the Joker, Shelley).
Your only real job in your whole misspent life is Pink Cross (oh, and congratulations on giving yourself a raise, Lubben, even though your Foundation’s rate of success has not increased). YOU NOW TAKE HOME MORE THAN FOUR TIMES AS MUCH AS THE COMMISSIONER OF THE SALVATION ARMY.
Keep waiting for that “one big donor” to thrust you into the big-time, Lubben. By the time I’m done with you, you’ll only be left with the racist, anti-semitic, white power donors whom you STILL refuse to repudiate. I guess it really IS all about the money — isn’t it.
See you at AdultCon. AND at the June OSHA meeting. And anywhere else I can undermine your perverse efforts in the name of self aggrandizement.
Your Jewish Treasure,
MW
Sometimes I wish I weren’t a journalist; then I could give “slubben” (or “slub,” as I will probably refer to her in the future) all the ignore-ance she so richly deserves. But like the proverbial “bad penny,” she keeps showing up, so what can I do?
In the meantime, people can read my report of the CalOSHA board meeting here — http://tinyurl.com/4qurwto –and form their own opinions of her by what she herself said. Of course, she has no believable response for the question that, if she were actually “forced” or “coerced” into performing the sex scenes (that she signed up for and was paid for), why didn’t she report those RAPES to the cops? Ever? And somehow, I don’t think she’ll be winning friends and influencing people — that is, adult women performers — in the adult industry by charging in public that they’re “young, dumb females who couldn’t read a contract,” and who “can’t even understand words like ‘litigation’ or ‘arbitration.'”
Beyond that, all one has to do is to watch Michael Whiteacre’s excellent documentary (at least, what I’ve seen so far of it is excellent) The Devil and Shelly Lubben where Slub’s many lies are refuted by … HERSELF!
@origen – Apparently (and not surprisingly) your “constructive criticism” did not mean jack shit to Mrs. Lubben — a few hours ago she posted this on her Facebook wall: “We will NOT stop fighting pornography and we will continue to pull people out of porn slave trade!”
She also posted a photo of her youngest (minor) children holding up Pink Cross propaganda signs for the camera to make their mom happy. Shelley Lubben will exploit ANYONE, even her own children.
Kernes, you are not a journalist, you work for Fishbein, he has yet to have a true piece of journalism in AVN…ever. I’m not sure why anyone would want to buy Gene’s site, I know some people will ask why Cindi bought Luke’s page(and I think she was damn generous too). Big difference is that Cindi doesnt mail it in like Gene and whoever else is there, well whoever is writing it for Gene. As for safety and condom use in the business I think we have to look the amount of crossover performers and who’s hiring them and where they are working, meaning Florida.
@@MARK KERNES,
You say that sometimes you wish you werent a jounalist,,,,,,Your wish came true a long time ago.
@Michael, what trypically happens when a female performer recieves an injury,like a torn vagina or anus, on set? And we ALL KNOW this happens reguarly. WHo typically pays to treat this injury?
(as if we will ever get a straight answer to this one). Jeremy, or Lucky,, could you answer this one, I know we will get an HONEST answer from you guys.
@Michael,
“Shelley will exploit ANYONE, even her own children.”
Kind of like Steve Hirsh having his own children in his tv show on SHowtime about the porn industry, wouldnt you agree?
@Mark Kernes,,,why, as a journalist, have you NEVER mentioned that the OSHA proposal put forth by AHF specifically ELIMINATES the need for dental dams, and goggles in porn? Why do you mention these items in every single article you write, but never mention that AHF’s proposal eliminates them.
KERNES, have you ever read the AHF proposal, and if so, why do you keep mentioning goggle and dental dams. You are as much of a journalist as I am. Just becuase I look at the stars at night does not make me an astronomer. Just becuase you write article for a trade magazine does not make you a journalist. I can call a rose a monkey, but it is still a rose. I can call myself a journalist, but I am still just a poster on a message board.
@Joe know – Jeez, man, don’t you have spell check?
Theres no comparison between what Lubben has done and what Hirsch has done. If you’d seen the stuff Lubben has used her kids for, and how she’s posed them, you’d understand. These shots will be in the documentary. One in particular is so disgustingly low that even you might be offended. here’s a hint: a professional who works with the police on sex crimes says, in his professional opinion, that one of the shots would “almost certainly” appeal to some pedophiles (ones that like little girls).
And, not to answer for Mark Kernes but, why does it matter what AHF’s proposal includes? Or what FSC’s proposal includes, for that matter? What matters is what OSHA’s proposal includes. We’ll be seeing that before the June 7th meeting.
joe know: so “the OSHA proposal put forth by AHF specifically ELIMINATES the need for dental dams, and goggles in porn”? Well, ONE of us doesn’t know how to read, and it’s you… the NON-journalist.
From the petition: “Each employer engaged in the production of adult films is required to maintain engineering and work practice controls sufficient to protect employees from exposure to blood and/or any potentially infectious materials. Engineering and work practice controls include, BUT ARE NOT LIMITED TO…” (emphasis added)
Translation: “Hi, I’m Shelley Lubben and I’m a stalker, and I’m very disappointed by actresses not showing up for a business meeting because I’ve missed an opportunity to make sex workers feel bad about themselves to their face.” (lol)
Oh, please, Ministeress Lubben…spare us.
You know darn well that that meeting was only a tactical meeting for introducing the ultimate draft of the condom mandate, and that the real meeting will come June 7. Also…so easy to complain about no adult performers showing up when you can slant the panel so that no opponents can even be allowed to speak for themselves.
Besides…what difference does it make, if victory is inevitable and the condom mandate is a fait accompli??
As for Joe Know…well, same song, 1,456th verse. Been there, refuted that. Next.
At least Mark Kernes actually read the proposals done by Cal-OSHA (with AHF’s full backing and collusion). Did you, Joe…or are you still connected to Mike Weinstein’s brain cells too much to allow any different input??
Anthony
LOL ANTHONY,
I will be back shortly with a link to the proposal so you cn actually READ IT YOURSELF, instesd of relying of industy hack Mark kernes to give you a section of one paragraph.. While the term
Not limited to” is used in the proposal, their is specific language that eliminates goggles and dental dams. If Mark Kernes were a REAL journalis he might point out that this proposal may NOT meet the FEDERAL OSHA standard, but the proposal speaks for itself.
mark Kernes, your post above here only confirms that you are no more a journalist than Michael Whiteacre is an unbiased documentary film maker.
And Marks quote is also in the CURRENT standsrds, so thank you for pointing out again that currently adult companies are inviolation of the law(regulation) a majority of the time.
Mark, as a journalist have you ever done any stories on what happens to females on a set who get injuries like I mentioned above, vaginal or anal tears or throat injuries? Have you ever even looked into this subject that one would think a JOURNALIST would at least investigate, given that you cover the INDUSTRY, (but not that part of the industry eh, Mark?) After all, why would AVN print an article about girls getting their asses ripped to sherds, then dropped off at St. Josephs Hospital in Burbank and told, “God Luck, Bye.”
Mark, could you provide any links to ANY article AVN has ever done on this subject that affects performers on a regular basis.
ANTHONY,,,YES, I have read the entire proposal, have you?
@WHiteacre,,,,,OSHA’s proposal, as you call it, is, as of now, the CURRENT STANDARD, which, as of now, is the law, which as of now, the adult film industry is breaking every single day. THE current standards are currently the LAW.
@Whiteacre,,,,Hirsch, using his children in his show about the adult industry is disgusting in and of itself, whether it reaches the level of what Shelley does or not. Do you think for one minute that HIRSH allows his own children to even watch the show that he uses them in, I would certainly hope not, and I would assume that he doesnt. To use your own kids in a reality show that you wouldnt even let them watch is pretty low on the disgusting scale.
ANthony, as far as OSHA’s full bcking of AHF,, you got to be kidding. OSHA, and county health for that matter, have IGNORED the industry for decades,,,they have been dragged into this by the legal manuvers of AHF. OSHA would like nothing better than to go back to the good old days of “out of sight, out of mind.”
This current OSHA, AFH bullshit began abut TWO YEARS ago. IF, and thats a big IF, OSHA were REALLY concerned about this issue they wouldnt be taking YEARS, and scheduling meetings months from now, only to have more meetings months after that. And the C ounty has been aware of the std situation for YEARS too, but not until AHF, or articles in the newspapers push them into action have they ever done anything. County Health made all this noise back in 2004, then, when the issue disappeared from the headlines they went right back to ignoring the industry as they have for years.
I find it particularly funny tthough, how some industry types know EVERYTHING about what SOHA and SHelley and County healths motives and positions onissues are, but when it comes to discussing the industry’s motives and psitions on those ame isues the silence is deafening. I think EVERYBODY is full of shit.
Can at least one industry person educate all of us as to what usually happens when a performer gets injured. How can you accurately debate the issue without discussing these FACTS. And instead of turning the the question back to OSHA or AHF, why not just answer it?
If you read closely what I write, instead of giving the same kenn jerk reaction, you would see that I think just about EVERYBODY in this debate is full of baloney, and I will call OSHA and the conty, and Shelley and the INDUSTRY on thier crap. What gets my blood going here is the people who will not even acknoledge that the PRODUCERS(employers) have some responsible role to play in this. PRODUCERS make the CHOICE to producer porn. WIthout the PRODUCER, no porn gets made.(what came first the chicken or the egg,,,what comes first, the PRODUCER or the performer? Well in this case it is the PRODUCER who comes first, and as such, the buck stops at the TOP, and that is the producer. The industruies entire response to this issue has NOT been what is best for performers, it has been how can we make sure PRODUCERS are not held responsible for what happens i their workplace.
Joey…as usual, you are as full of shit as a Turducken, but with far less taste.
Yes, I am well aware of the current regulations, but there really is no need for you to email me them, because I am already well aware of them, thank you very much.
And…let us remember that what was being proposed is still a DRAFT copy, which probably will be refined and revised before it is finally released as a rule for final approval. So, in essence, all we are doing here is assuming what the final regs will be. Given AHF’s full collusion with Cal-OSHA in the formation of the rules, however, we can probably be assured that the condom mandate will be part of the final rule.
Also..no, Joey, Mark Kernes’ AVN article did not actually say that the AHF/Cal-OSHA proposed rule would directly mandate dental dams and other more intrusive means of “protection”. But, if they are as serious as they say about stopping the threat of “bloodborne pathogens” and “protecting” the performers from mostly invisible threats of infection (how many female performers have been infected with HIV or any other STD through oral sex, exactly??), it’s a possibility that they will include dental dams as a requirement.
Of course, Joey doesn’t give a rat’s ass about dental dams anyway…it’s the condoms he and Weinstein want to shove down performers’ throats…mostly for the gold mine of favorable contracts with condom makers and the largeese of exclusive government grant money.
And all this smack about how the “INDUSTRY” doesn’t give a damn about its performers and how Cal-OSHA has been dropping the ball until AHF and the condom mandaters pulled them back to reality?? Yeah, right. The reason the issue died down after 2004 has nothing to do with an “INDUSTRY” conspiracy against performers; it has much to do with AIM adjusting their policies to strengthen their protections, as well as individual performers doing the same. Of course, Joey, if you still want to raise that tainted stat about 24 performers getting HIV from shoots between 2004 and 2009, well, fire away. Most of us know the actual facts.
And not to mention that the two scares of 2009 and 2010 still resulted in NO transmissions of HIV outside of the original Patient Zeros/Zetas (unless Darrah Ford can come clean with that alleged second performer whom she alleges contracted HIV from Derrick Burts). But, hey, why let the facts get in the way of a good witchhunt?? It certainly got Sharon Mitchell and AIM out of the way….oh, wait, it didn’t?? AIM still exists as a private org?? Well…I guess that Weinstein will just have to try that much harder to take them out and assume his monopoly on porn performer testing, then.
Finally, Joey..for someone who says that EVERYBODY in this debate is so full of (sh)it, you sure have a way of exempting AHF and Ministeress Lubben from your analysis. But then again, you have that special way of exempting anyone you favor from your wrath, as long as it suits your ideology.
And on your final missive about PRODUCERS being the top of the feed chain?? Well, producers can’t make a damn thing or a profit without WORKERS doing the hard work; and neither producers nor workers can make a red cent without VIEWERS willing to buy their content. You may believe that most porn consumers will take to wrapped porn because they will have no choice after bareback is banished from the face of the earth…but I say that people aren’t as dumb as you think. There are other venues and other locations where bareback porn can and will be made; and as long as people have money and are willing to pay, and there are performers who are willing to do bareback, it’s not going to disappear into the ether no matter how much you or Shelley Lubben or Michael Weinstein or Violet Blue or Chi Chi LaRue might wish it to be. Instead of attempting to gag performers with condoms, why not simply work with those performers and producers who are willing to promote safer sex and fund them to produce better and more erotic condomized porn??
Oh, wait..I forgot. Joe Blow is a Far Right wingnut who believes, like Shelley Lubben, that any porn performer who doesn’t agree with them is “diseased”, stupid, and mentally ill; and should never be allowed to make decisions about their bodies without their expressed approval. That explains quite a lot.
Oh…and Mark Kernes and Mike Whiteacre and Lydia Lee (and myself as well) have never attempted to say that they (or moi) are “unbiased”. Clearly, we have a set opinion of beliefs about condoms that differs from yours. That only makes us “biased” to the extent that we don’t share YOUR bias. So sorry, but we reserve the right to disagree when we see bullshit sold as public policy. Don’t like it, Joey?? Too bad…this is Cindi’s space, not yours.
Anthony