Brash newcomers vs veterans was an underlying theme on Los Angeles radio station KLSX Sunday morning, 8/16/98.

Four months into his three-hour weekly gig with FM 97.1, Ed Powers hosted porners Rob Black, Tom Byron and Loretta Sterling aka Ed deRoo of Totally Tasteless Video. They discussed porn's increasing preoccupation with the nasty, which veterans like deRoo and Russ Hampshire (VCA) fear will cause legal prosecutions for obscenity.

Hampshire did not appear on the show as scheduled.

DeRoo, who represented the conservative and traditional perspective, began in porn in the late '70s, and even employed Powers as a salesman around 1980. He says he faced a 16-count indictment (in 1979's MIPORN bust?) early in his career. Out of such busts, emerged an informal list of no-nos for porners drawn up in 1980 by several Catholic female judges in Los Angeles County - no bestiality, fisting, child porn, non consensual sex, urination, defecation, racial slurs…

"In the last year or so, all these guidelines have gone to hell," complained deRoo. "We fought. We spent a lot of money. My health, my life was at stake…"

Byron: "Did it [guidelines] say anything about 87-year old ladies?"

Laughter.

[Tom refers to a tape from deRoo's company which features an 87-year old lady having sex. Sterling has also released tapes of women having sex during menstruation and other tasteless themes.]

DeRoo: "No, but we have a minimum of 18."

Powers: "But you didn't put her in a wheelchair and throw her in a dumpster." [Referring to Rob Black's controversial video Miscreants.]

Black: "Loretta, did you do Period Pieces, where girls are on their periods?"

DeRoo: "That's correct."

Laughter.

Powers: "He thinks that's defendable."

DeRoo: "It's a natural thing."

Black: "It's a movie. It's entertainment… I respect them for going through that [federal government prosecution for obscenity]. Now it's our turn. We may have to go through that. Then we'll be telling the guys who take our places, 'we fought for you…' Times change.

"Remember, early in the '70s, the movies were outrageous with rape…"

Powers: "Don't you think we should move ahead instead of backwards?"

Liz, Ed Powers' cohost and former porn performer: "If you didn't have artistic freedom, you couldn't create a weird ass movie."

DeRoo: "We have artistic freedom without stepping over those lines. We're role models… Black crosses the line with violence and racial innuendo."

Black: "I've done two scenes with rape. Look at VCA's early movies with rape… The Dark Brothers… My movies are not like Max Hardcore who's sticking speculums in girls for no rhyme or reason…"

Black and Byron clearly appeared prepared for a debate with Hampshire and company. Their arguments were sharp.

Steve from Reseda phones: "What does Rob think about his mother calling Jane Hamilton and asked her not to shoot him?"

Hamilton has said that nasty porn like that of Black makes her feel like shooting those who make it.

Rob's mother has been actively campaigning on behalf of her wayward son. I received email from her and we chatted on AOL's I.M.. At the latest VSDA, Rob's mom walked getting autographs, and eventually started talking with Jane Hamilton. Rob's mom asked Jane not to shoot her son.

Roger Pipe phones in from Fullerton: "I do erotic film reviews for the internet. I've been hard on Rob Black."

Rob: "You gave me a good review on my last movie, Moral Degeneration."

Rog: "If I wanted something different, I'd go to VCA… For another company to come down on these guys [Rob Black] is ridiculous. The same people that want to shut Rob down are going to come after you, Ed."

Powers: "I agree. It's up to the viewers. If they don't like something, they don't have to watch. That these gentlemen are selling 4000 tapes out the door, it shows something. Rob is talented."

DeRoo: "I fought long hard battles to get these guidelines in [legitimating porn] that he's tending to cross… But on the other hand, you have some of these magazines [Hustler, Penthouse] that show urination. I had a terrible bust for less than one second of urination. I went to jail in 1979.

"We were wide open at the time. We had no guidelines. And the guidelines that did come down were kinda unspoken, just an agreement between us and the government that we wouldn't cross those lines. They can't make an agreement with us. It's illegal to say that this is legal and this isn't. If our youngsters start crossing those lines, he's going to pull heat on the whole industry."

Black: "They've created this little incestuous group… And over the years, they've liked to keep people out. The big dogs at the top would pick and choose. They don't like people like me shaking the system. I feel that today's climate has changed. Ed, would you have ever imagined that FM 97.1, a station owned by CBS, would give a radio show to a pornographer."

Byron: "The people who run this business today are ashamed of what they do."

Black: "The big dogs, the Russ's [Hampshires], made their living, started their niche, by doing what I'm doing. Russ started Greg Dark and Let Me Tell Ya About White Chicks. Russ Hampshire did the first scene where a girl was having sex in a Klu Klux Klan outfit. What about the movie by John Leslie, Second Skin, where he had Jamie Gillis humiliate Ona Zee. Walter Gernert…"

Steven from Malibu: "There should be no censorship. This goes back three weeks ago when you were talking with Luke F-rd about publishing real names and addresses…"

Liz: "That's different."

Powers: "We're not talking about censoring him."

Steven: "You may not agree with him. You may not be happy about it. It may not be right. But the bottom line is, there should be no censorship. One of the comparisons made on the show three weeks ago was that real celebrities change their names too. But real celebrities get their addresses protecting either through corporations or business managers… If the girls are concerned about stalkers, they should take the same precautionary steps.

"When you had Luke F-rd on three weeks ago, you [Ed Powers] were criticizing him for publishing addresses and names."

Powers: "I didn't criticize him. I brought it to light. There's a difference between a mainstream celebrity and an Adult celebrity… Because if they're stalked, they're being stalked for sex."

Steven: "The industry can't have it both ways. They can't cry for freedom of speech then turn around and when someone publishes something that they don't like, then complain about it. I'm not saying that I like what Luke does… or that he is a good journalist.

"These people [porners] are celebrities. Ed, I know where you live. You've invited me to your house before… That doesn't mean that I'm going to turn it over to the public, but if Luke has chosen to do that as a journalist, albeit a bad journalist, that should be within his First Amendment right to do so."

Powers: "What about courtesy? This is a smaller industry than Hollywood. People don't make as much money. People can't afford body guards…

"I feel for the people, for the women, who disagree with their names being published… They have a right to legally challenge… My name is in there and I did not complain about it. There have been people who have asked Luke to remove their names, and he has done it. And he has agreeably done it. He did say that he would not remove their names if…"

Steven: "Isn't that a form of censorship? Let's say Elton John or Barbara Streisand call a publisher… Because she does not like the slant of a story and she wanted it altered. She didn't like the way the interview went and she wanted it changed. That's a form of censorship. So, if the entertainers within the adult industry are calling Luke and asking him to delete their address, they're putting pressure… He shouldn't be asked to retract something so long as it is truthful…"

Powers: "His open policy is that you can do that. I know that Luke's listening and he can mention his policy. He's human being."

Steven: "If you look at his web site, it's obvious that he's getting a lot of heat over the names and addresses issue. The industry is acting hypocritically to ask for free speech and to constantly test boundaries, then turn around and as soon as something happens that they don't like, complain about it. The guests on your show three weeks ago were adamantly opposed to what Luke was doing."

Powers: "The people who were here and who called in were adamant about it [against publishing porn stars real names]… Luke felt it was a good show."

DeRoo: "I wonder what his definition of censorship was. What about rights to privacy? We have certain laws and certain rights…"

Two minutes later…

Powers: "We all know that Luke F-rd is on the phone."

Luke: "G-day Ed, how are you doing? Thanks for having me on your show.

"I have never, ever, never published anyone's address or phone number. I have printed many real names, most of them are real names that have been published elsewhere. If someone passionately opposes my publishing their real name, I will take that very seriously and frequently will take it down. My exceptions are - If they have worked under their real name in many videos, or if they have been published in the New York Times under their real name, I usually will not take it [real name] down…

"As a journalist, I want to reveal as much about the industry as I can within basic guidelines of decency. For me, publishing addresses is outside the bounds of decency. Printing information about someone's children, generally speaking, would be outside the bounds of decency… I take into consideration the feelings of my subjects…"

Powers: "That sets the record straight… Does anyone have a question for Luke F-rd?"

Byron: "I read his web site a lot."

Black: "I do too but I'm never in it though. Everyone always complains because he says stuff, but I always look and he never says stuff about me. Come on Luke."

Powers: "Luke, how come you never say anything about Rob Black?"

Luke: "I want to interview Rob Black. I was talking with his mother via AOL's Immediate Chat. She said she was going to help arrange an interview for me, but it hasn't come off yet. But I need to pick up the phone and call Rob…"

Powers: "Loretta, do you have anything for Luke?"

Loretta: "I think it is wrong to print people's real names… In all the years in the business, we've tried to be underground and stay in the background… We don't tell everybody our real names and we keep a lot of things secret just so the government doesn't get a hold of it."

Powers: "I don't think we have anything to hide though. I love this government."

Black: "Me too. I love them. I don't care if people know my name."

Powers: "I love Los Angeles, New York and those places where there are not the strictest of community standards… Right Luke?"

Luke: "Right. This show tonight touches on many important issues… In life, there are many great and conflicting values. Free Speech is a great value but there are other great conflicting values too such as decency, modesty, privacy… We all need to be careful about being extremists. Extremists take a good value such as free speech, or privacy or religion or Christianity, and they take it too far… We need to acknowledge that our opponents, those concerned about what we do, whether it is publishing real names or portraying rape in a sexually explicit movie, that our opponents have some strong arguments and that values must be constantly balanced against each other. We can't just take one good value and say that this overrides all others…"

Byron?: "So we take out all portrayals of rapes in all movies, R-rated… Why is it that it is only our movies [porn] where rape is wrong?"

Powers: "Luke, thank you for calling this week. I'm glad you were listening. I knew you were listening."

Luke: "Thanks Ed. You're the man."

Powers: "And call me, will you?"

Luke: "I will. Bye, bye…"

Connor phones: "What do you guys think of Max Hardcore? He seems like a sadistic weirdo."

Powers has invited Max on the show.

Rob: "I don't think much [of Max Hardcore]. It's a funny looking guy in a cowboy hat putting speculums in girls. I have stronger opinions but I won't… Yes, I've heard girls complain about him…"

Ed Powers talked about his days selling videos for Ed deRoo. Then Powers published Hot Times magazine.

Black: "Is that the one [magazine] that you [Ed deRoo] used to cut speed on?"

Powers: "Then I picked up a camera in 1988 and began the Bus Stop Tales. Then the gates opened…"

DeRoo: "You [Ed Powers] used to live in that little house in Burbank. You had all these Polaroids of girls…"

Jack phones. Porn girls have told him of being abused by Max Hardcore. "People want to watch blood and guts… Talent are getting abused. That has to be stopped. We should not distribute their movies."

Powers: "Distributors are distributing their movies. So now what do we do? The viewers have to take responsibility to not watch…

"I offered one girl a good amount of money. She felt unworthy. She worked for someone else [Max Hardcore?] for half as much, and got abused."

Jack: "Is John T. Bowen still in the business?"

Murmurings of yes.

Johnathan, 19, phones: "Why is bondage and intercourse illegal?"

DeRoo: "More people have gone to jail for bondage and hardcore movies than for any other subject matter. Even today…"

Mark Archer from Van Nuys, aka Toe Boy: "I've got a copy of Tom Byron's latest - Lord of Asses. And there's a scene where this girl pleases him with her feet…"

Rob Black: "I just signed this new director, Mark Archer… He worked at this woman's show store…"

Irwin calls: "Steven and Luke are morons… He has no idea about the difference between censorship and privacy…If you published his address and phone number, he would not be happy…"

DeRoo: "He just liked to hear himself talk."

Rob: "I'd love find a hot chick with no legs…A great gimick."

Black: "Pick up line three… Melissa [Bardiz Bania]…"

Powers: "Here's Christy Canyon."

Christy: "I'm driving home from the Spearmint Rhino club in the City of Industry [after stripping]… We were looking forward to a big debate and we're upset that we didn't get to hear it. My bodyguard Joe has not missed one week on the road in seven years.

"Did Rob brag to everybody how he blew it with dating Victoria Paris? [Vic recently decided to not sign with Rob's company Extreme Associates.]

"Rob had another girlfriend but Victoria Paris was in major lust with him and he [Rob] got all nervous. She loved it when Rob called her at 2:39 in the morning on a Saturday night and woke her up."

Powers: "Christy, do you want to say hi to Loretta Sterling?"

Christy: "Who's that?"

Powers: "Can I say your real name? Yes. Eddie deRoo."

Christy: "Oh, I did films for you [Enchantress, Midsummer Nights Dreams, The Starlets]. Rob, good luck with your video company. You know you're hot and that's what scares them."

Next caller asked about a fisting scene in Shane's World that was digitalized out.

Bruce phones: "Rob, your movies are great. Nice girls, nice bodies. But I don't like it when you go from color to black and white."

Black and Powers: "It's artsy fartsy…"

Black: "Depends on what drug I was on that day…"

Powers: "He ran out of color."

Caller: "All these things that you say are illegal… I'm able to find them at the video store…"

Sterling: "This administration is lenient."

Caller: "They're crossing the line and nobody's prosecuting. I hear that you can go to Vegas and get any kind of video..."

Rob: "I did a movie with a pregnant chick and it was horrible. Some of the distributors wouldn't take it…How do you [Loretta Sterling] have a problem with my movie Miscreants which has a plot and a rape scene, when you do a gonzo with six girls who are eight months pregnant? That's over the line."

Sterling: "That's beautiful [pregnant chicks]. The girls have a certain glow about them."

Powers says Kia has retired to concentrate on stripping.

Former Rosebud contract girl Anisa, anal queen, phoned to say hi.

Liz: "Rob Black, do you like things in your butt, like Tom Byron?"

Rob: "No."

Loretta Sterling said he had two girls go into labor while shooting a pregnant video for him - Crystal Knight and Bunny Bleu.

Byron said Traci Lords was his favorite porn girl. They lived together as boyfriend-girlfriend.

Hart Williams remains annoyed with the FSC's inept handling of the Erotic Film Awards.

"According to Luke's interview of "Saint" Russ Hampshire of VCA, VCA contributed $15K and AVN another $8K, which means that there should be $10K in prizes (as advertised) and $13K for whatever else. (Hmmmm.)

"Do I feel ripped off? You bet.

"Am I angry at being conned into attending the World Pornography Conference?

You bet.

Am I contemplating a lawsuit against FSC? You bet.

Am I REALLY PISSED that I've exposed my tricks and the new operating systems we've been debugging to at least 20 Industry Insiders (who will undoubtedly rip off anything that they like) without having been shown *once* to an audience? Yup.

I don't find the words to express how incompetent, how unjust and how idiotic this all has been. Perhaps I'll have to invent them:

The organizers of this festival are a bunch of ghenivalblzts.

They should have a live hnukylsiem shoved up their sneegs and allowed to fnargle for a good long time.